ECU back to CAA?

Discussion in 'Smack' started by 70sHawk, Sep 18, 2011.

  1. 70sHawk

    70sHawk Active Member

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    Now that Pitt and Syracuse are leaving the Big East (leaving it with only 6 football playing schools), ECU's hopes of joining the Big East as a football-only school have probably improved dramatically.

    On the other hand, that means that ECU will be searching for a home for the rest of its sports...which means get ready for Terry Holland to call Tom Yeager about re-joining the CAA.

    We all know that Yeager would take them back (heck he took RICHMOND - which shows the level of the man's self-respect - back in football).

    But - assuming no one leaves - does going above 12 teams make any sense for conference MEMBERS (not the league office) ? And, if so, why would it be in the interest of CAA members for ECU to be that school?
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  2. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    Oh jeez, this is going to be a sh*tstorm.

    Cue SJ in 5...4...3...2...
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  3. 70sHawk

    70sHawk Active Member

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    Still Jonesn lurking on the CAA Zone??? No Way!!

    I'll save him the time and post his position in advance: "Whatever ECU wants to do is in the best interest of whoever they do it with". I honestly don't have animosity toward ECU. But they chose to leave the CAA because they thought it was in their best interest. The CAA should only let them (or anyone else) in if it is in the interest of the current membership.

    My question was directed toward UNCW fans an, by extension, to fans of other existing CAA schools...the ones who chose not to leave.
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2011
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  4. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    Objectively, they will help CAA baseball a lot obviously. Basketball will give us another mid-pack program but it does give UNCW a natural rival which will be great for you guys. If ECU is on the way up as SJ wants everyone to believe than more competition at the top is never a bad thing, although I'll believe it when I see it since we've never seen it from ECU ever.

    I think it helps ECU more than it helps the CAA since they aren't doing anything for the football aspect of the conference and they are mediocre at best when it comes to our marquee sport in basketball. I think it will definitely help raise the conference profile in baseball though. That's probably the one place it actually helps us.
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  5. TheGreenMonk

    TheGreenMonk New Member

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    As long as they remain a non-BCS team in football I would have no problem having them back. They’d bring more pros than cons to the CAA and it would be nice to play them during conference play for all our other sports. If the Big East remains in the BCS, and they somehow joined as a football only member, no way should the CAA allow them back. The money advantage they would have over our (meaning all of the current CAA) sport programs would make them an upper echelon team based on being able to pay more for coaches, scholarships, facilities, etc. It makes no sense to prop them up and have to compete for NCAA bids against an athletic department with more money because the football conference they play in doesn’t want them as a full member. Also, they’d degrade the CAA’s academic reputation (just kidding ECU fans, well, not really…).
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  6. StillJonesn

    StillJonesn Guest

    The CAA would make a lot of sense if we were offered a football only invite. That said I don't think ECU spent $40 million last year on new Olympic sports complex, a track, tennis courts, soccer and softball stadiums, and basketball practice facility to accept just a football only invite. We have BCS level facilities in every sport now and complete athletics that would help any conference.

    That’s pretty elite company last spring and women’s soccer is ranked this fall so it‘s not just baseball. I don’t know what other schools the CAA could add that bring as much or have as much potential but there really is only one other school in the non BCS that has more support than ECU and that’s BYU. We've never been as commited as we are in basketball right now and it's certainly moving in the right direction.

    Monk you can talk about academic reputations but much of the CAA doesn’t offer any doctoral degrees or much research of any kind where reputations are made. ECU has contibuted a lot, and on issues that will impact most of us. When you or your family members have heart related issues as most of us will, remember that the procedures that are saving your life could have been created at ECU.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 18, 2011
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  7. jumpinmullet

    jumpinmullet Active Member

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    I am dead set against ECU coming back to the CAA because that would mean that UNCW is staying in the CAA and I think they need to get out ASAP.If they do come back in it would seal the deal and UNCW would be stuck.I don't think ECU wants to go backwards and they are really in a tough spot now and nobody seems to want them other than a CAA type deal and they have a lot bigger dreams than that.
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  8. nitneylion

    nitneylion New Member

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    Mullet, where do you want UNCW to go?
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  9. hawkfan4life

    hawkfan4life New Member

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    We need to stay in the caa. The southern conference does not get at large bids to the ncaa tourney.
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  10. jumpinmullet

    jumpinmullet Active Member

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    The CAA will most likely change now and who knows what will happen to the A-10 either.I would like to see UNCW in a conference that makes some kind of sense for all sports and not just basketball.A more regional mix of schools.SoCon seems to be a close fit but the snob factor here is against it for some reason.If UNCW is it the stuff and better than the SoCon I can't see it on paper at all.
    B
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  11. witsendhawk

    witsendhawk New Member

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    LLooks like A10 is going to lose Xavier to Big East according to sources which will make that conference fall even farther. The Southern going to lose App state and Ga Southern. The CAA is the best place for us by far and quickly becoming top midmajor basketball league. But we don't need to add weak basketball schools like E Carolina but should be adding GW who has a solid program. We beat them at their place this year and could have a good rivalry witht them which started when we played them in the NCAA tourney in 2006. Another would be Charleston who has become a good rival. But E Carolina hasnt had a winning season in 15 years and adds nothing to the CAA.
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  12. StillJonesn

    StillJonesn Guest

    Not true, but regardless any way you want to look at last year we had one of the biggest improvements in the nation under our first year coach and a top 100 team. Even the biggest haters out there can't deny the program is going in the right direction or the new level of financial commitment and facilites. We pay Lebo 3 times what we paid Mack for example and he turned down Penn State to stay and I think will be here for a while.

    We've played in a conference with basketball schools like Louisville, Cincy, Memphis, Marquette etc. I certainly don't think it's far fetched that we could again the way things are going. We were actually close to getting into the Big East with in the last year before this all went down and UCF, ECU, and Houston were on the short list so if we were good enough to play alongside those BB schools in hoops or to seriously be considered to play along side schools like UConn, Syracuse, Georgetown etc I think we are certainly good enough to add value to the CAA.
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  13. jumpinmullet

    jumpinmullet Active Member

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    I do agree that ECU basketball would be a zero based on the history there but other sports namely baseball would be a huge upgrade to the CAA and would keep UNCW stuck in a Va based conference for years to come.Playing Northeastern and Hofstra for a UNCW makes no sense at all and they should be in a regional conference that competes with like schools.I would bet that Hofstra and NE would love to get out of the CAA and regret ever joining the CAA.I know the basketball argument is there for UNCW right now but nothing says things will stay this way for long and the time to get out could be right now.ECU will not be invited into the ACC or even the Big East unless the whole thing just falls apart.They are still a mid major and not a prime time player.
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  14. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    Tulane and Southern Mississippi can say the same thing about playing a league with those teams and they don't bring anything to CAA basketball either. Just because you played with some good teams doesn't somehow make you a good program. It's the same as touting being considered and rejected for the Big East as some kind of plus. Improvement or not, ECU has been one of the most unsuccessful college basketball programs on the East Coast. You have a winning record if you count non-D1 wins, and you have a top 100 RPI excluding those non-D1 wins which pad your win total. This after several losing seasons in a row and one of the worst overall basketball histories in the country. Let's be serious, ECU is not going to be added to the CAA for basketball value. That's never where ECU's value has been.
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  15. seahawkhoopsforever

    seahawkhoopsforever Active Member

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    Mullett- The days of regional based conferences are coming to an end.....go woth the changes or get run over
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  16. solohawks

    solohawks Active Member

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    socon = south carolina private schools who care about football

    caa = virigina based conference that cares about basektball

    both conferences have outliers and neither is a perfect fit. i would rather UNCW travel to new york and boston than Samford in Alabama. davidson and coc would replace vcu and gmu as our top schools of interest if we were to switch. i would rather they join us then us join them as the caa will and always will be a more competitive basketball conference
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  17. jumpinmullet

    jumpinmullet Active Member

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    It would help if Hofstra and NE would leave the CAA and then it would make a little sense to drive five hours to play Va based
    schools that have a lot more money to compete with,the days of regional conferences are not over for poor state schools like UNCW.I would not be surprised at all if the big boys freeze the little out and make up their championship conferences and tell the UNCW's of the world to take a hike.Money and football are the deal here and UNCW has no way to compete with these guys.COC will never join the CAA in this lifetime.Other than men's basketball is there a reason to stay in the CAA for UNCW?
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  18. StillJonesn

    StillJonesn Guest

    Yeah let's be serious. Basketball is nearly irrelevant when it comes to the factors driving expansion and has been for decades. You should know this better than anyone when schools like Lousiville and your metro friends dropped VCU years ago when they founded CUSA with Cincy and the great Midwest. Guess who they eventually added to that conference (ECU), while VCU was left you for dead in a conference we helped found and get UNCW in. None of these conferences really care about history or tradition all that much especially in basketball, only money and to say ECU doesn't add value to the CAA in 2011 and moving foward is a joke. We still have a chance at something better as a conference goes. I don't know if it happens but I wouldn't trade for your spot on the pecking order because VCU doesn't.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 19, 2011
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  19. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    Let's look at my statement.

    Am I saying anything that is any different that what you are saying in it's essence? Nope. ECU certainly has value to this conference, but not in basketball. You don't have to like it, but it's true. The one big picture sport that ECU is valuable for and is the only reason you have a bargaining chip in expansion is football. Well, guess what? That's not coming to the CAA. So the net gain for the CAA is limited. So what are you arguing? Nothing? That's what I thought.

    VCU is far better off in the CAA compared to the Metro, quite honestly. We were always a mid-pack team playing in Louisville's shadow, not as bad as ECU was, but it's safe to say the growth of our program had stalled from the 80's. We are far more competitive nationally now than we ever were back there. I'm pretty happy with where we are and we have been more successful than ECU can even dream about being in the sport that I care about. If ECU gets locked out of the big conferences (as it likely will), I really wouldn't trade my spot in the pecking order for yours either.
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  20. StillJonesn

    StillJonesn Guest

    Even as bad as ECU has been over the years we still have better facilities and support than most every school the CAA could realistically add in basketball moving foward, which would still make us valuable in basketball if nothing more than for the potential which BTW is all that's really important moving forward.

    The problem for VCU and UNCW is that if we are left behind in cusa or whatever eastern based conference was formed out of it we could make a couple phone calls and take most of the teams around you that you value like ODU, JMU, Charlotte, Delaware etc with football and if you believe JMU fans Holland has beenon their campus several times planning for that senerio for several years as the backup plan if we don't move on to better things.

    You'll say it won't happen but the fact several scrambled to add football kind of tells it all. Money talks and CUSA teams still make over 4 times as much in conference revenue. There is still a pecking order and I do belive that is the back up plan that has been in the works for several years..
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 19, 2011
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  21. jumpinmullet

    jumpinmullet Active Member

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    It is all about money and UNCW is on the very end of the money list.Basketball was once a big deal here but it has been years since Trask has been filled and it took over 25 years to get a upgrade done to Trask.With the lack of money both from the locals and being a step child to UNC it will not change here anytime soon.Buzz is looking like a good hire but he is sitting on go for the next job and we all know that.The CAA may survive this but only because the big boys don't care to invite anybody from the CAA to their party.Next up after all this could be that the NCAA will explode and the big boys will run their own show.
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  22. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    Of course ECU has the most potential. You haven't done anything. There is a TON of potential there when you're in that situation.

    I'm fairly confident that VCU and Mason will be joining ODU in any conference realignment that takes place at this level as 2 very valuable basketball programs. If not, I'm willing to bet the A-10 will come calling. Either way, we'll be fine. Everyone despaired when we left the Metro, and we are better off now than we ever were then.
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  23. StillJonesn

    StillJonesn Guest

    Wishful thinking Ram. Ask Charlotte fans. CUSA already pushed them and St Louis out once for not having football and there is no way CUSA or parts of it rebuild as a hybrid.

    ODU, JMU, Charlotte and Delaware aren't going to stay FCS forever, they are looking for a conference home for all their sports. If ECU fall to the CAA level again it's ECU that will be one of the ones calling the shots on how things are rebuilt around us.

    Maybe you hook up with some A10 BB schools, but the most desirable ones are catholic and likely going to hook up with the Big East BB's only's cathloics and UMass is gone so not sure who you are banking on joining you.

    VCU and Mason are not in good spots right now and Mullet might get his wish for UNCW if it shakes out a certain way. If it's bad for us it probably will be bad for you guys to.
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  24. hawkfan4life

    hawkfan4life New Member

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  25. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    I don't have to ask Charlotte or St. Louis...we were kicked out of the same conference, just earlier. We're better off than both of them now and better off than we ever were before we moved. I'm not worried at all. We're in good shape. This is the best possible time for us as a basketball school to be in this situation.

    Time will tell how it all pans out.
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  26. StillJonesn

    StillJonesn Guest

    Good luck because this could be the last big realignment for decades, and maybe even our lifetime. If we don't end up in a better situation I do think that is very possible the back up plan involves CUSA east (or what's left), Temple, and whatever FCS east coast teams are capable of moving up. Let's hope not because I don't want to be in that conference anymore than you want to lose them. If you take out the top CAA football schools and the A10 is picked over by the Big East Basketball only's then there really isn't much left for Mason, UNCW, and VCU so you should be concerned. Everyone should because every position outside of the top 4 conferences could take a turn for the worse all the way down. The gap is already only going to widen as it is as well.
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 19, 2011
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  27. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    You're saying the same thing you said before. We get it. You think we're all screwed.

    We don't.

    Good luck with conference realignment on your end. Hope it works out for you.
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  28. Cedric

    Cedric New Member

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    Former CBS Sports president Neal Pilson, now a sports-broadcasting consultant.

    “There aren’t many football-playing schools out there that bring a significant audience-factor with them; they’re all playing” in other conferences, Pilson said in a telephone interview. “The schools that are available now are the ones in the left-out category or the about-to-be-left-out category. There’s no easy solution here; there’s no quick fix.”

    Pilson is talking about ECU and all the other BCS wanna-be's. They are chasing something that TV has no interest in. ECU, JMU and ODU will soon be hemorrhaging debt over the dream they can't catch.
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  29. UNCW1987

    UNCW1987 New Member

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    "I don't have to ask Charlotte or St. Louis...we were kicked out of the same conference, just earlier. We're better off than both of them now "

    In what ways specifically?
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  30. ramnation

    ramnation New Member

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    We have cut costs significantly and are now in a less far-flung conference where we have 4 conference rivals within 2 hours driving distance and a much easier time going to the NCAA basketball tournament, something neither Charlotte nor St. Louis have been able to do for ages. We have the conference tournament every year in our backyard and we enjoy the 13th best homecourt advantage in the country since the Siegel Center opened in 1999 where we often have schools that travel well because of close proximity to Richmond.

    Instead of hiding in the shadows of Louisville, Southern Miss (when they had NBA star Clarence Witherspoon),Tulane (back when they were good), Virginia Tech, South Florida, St. Louis, Charlotte and others, we now are one of the big dogs in our conference in what has become one of the best mid-major basketball conferences in America. We just put out 2 NBA first round draft picks in consecutive years and have gone to the NCAA 3 times in 5 years with a win over Duke in 2007, a 1-pt. loss to UCLA in 2009, and a trip to the Final Four in 2011. Look at what St. Louis and Charlotte have done in that time span and tell me who is better off. I'll tell you, I wouldn't trade where we are for where they are hiding behind Xavier, Dayton, and Temple and completely irrelevant as far as basketball is concerned.
    #30

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